giacomo
Co-Founder
The vessel with the pestle...
Posts: 1,295
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Post by giacomo on Aug 23, 2009 17:57:40 GMT -5
We need to make one more decision before I can set up Season 3: if we're going to have one tournament with Am and Pro settings and two separate leaderboards (the vote was a strong majority- 13 to 5), we need a method of determining who will be assigned to use pro settings. To clarify, pro settings will require
- spin OFF - Putt Preview OFF - AHOs OFF
By a slim margin, our earlier poll showed that members prefer 11-9 that Any putting style be permitted for all settings, so Standard swing and Any putting style will be permitted with pro settings. A player can opt to play a tourney with either Am or Pro settings, or can play both styles. However, players who fit the criteria we're selecting would be required to play with Pro settings only.
So please indicate which of the criteria you'd like for determining who's required to play with Pro settings; or give an alternative that we can all consider.
Thanks! G.
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jeffro09
Co-Founder
I reckon I should learn how to hit this here driver
Posts: 410
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Post by jeffro09 on Aug 23, 2009 18:30:39 GMT -5
So to be clear....If a player by the Admin standards should be playing in the Pro category rather than the Ameteur would be required to play pro settings but they would still be allowed to use standard swing and any style putting correct?
I am a little slow sometimes.
Jeffro
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giacomo
Co-Founder
The vessel with the pestle...
Posts: 1,295
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Post by giacomo on Aug 23, 2009 18:32:34 GMT -5
That's correct. Therefore, you're not slow!
G.
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Post by broflowski on Aug 24, 2009 7:12:21 GMT -5
What is the goal for having two leaderboards? Is the goal to have mutually exclusive participants, or is it to have two different styles of rules?
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Post by thebeezer on Aug 24, 2009 7:33:53 GMT -5
Are the Pros also required to declare their round that counts before the round begins, or has that been dropped for this season?
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giacomo
Co-Founder
The vessel with the pestle...
Posts: 1,295
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Post by giacomo on Aug 24, 2009 10:17:08 GMT -5
I need to post this in a separate thread, but was waiting for the outcome of this poll. By way of clarification here's what I got from the brainstorming and polls regarding how Season 3 should be laid out (note: the brainstorming thread and the polls are in the Round Table archive if you want to review them):
1. There should be 6 tourneys over 6 weeks, all specified when the season starts so that members can play them in any order and whenever they want.
2. There should be 1 tourney defined for each week, and it should be available with Pro and Am settings. Thus, there should be 2 leaderboards, one for Am and one for Pro. In other words, both Pro and Am will play a tourney at, say, Turnberry. Both will have, as an example, any putting style, black tees, hard pin placements, fast greens, fast fairways, long rough, cloudy weather, and breezy winds. However, the Am tourney will permit spin, putt preview and AHOs. The Pro tourney will require that spin, putt preview and AHOs be turned off. Of course, as with all WiiGA matches, they tourneys will be played Unranked. Additionally, by a slim margin, Any putting style will be available in all tourneys, regardless of other settings.
3. Each tourney will have 2 rounds. No replays are possible. So you can practice to your heart's content using no password or using the password wiigap for practice rounds with other WiiGA members. But once you begin a tourney setup using the tourney password (wiiga1a, for instance), that round counts, no exceptions. Thus all players are effectively declaring an official round when they play using the tourney password. If the tourney password is not used, the round can not be counted as a tourney round.
4. Your personal profile will be used in 5 of the 6 tourneys. One tourney will require a stock profile. You may, or course, use stock profiles in any tourneys; but only one tourney will disallow the use of the personal profile.
One item that came up in both the brainstorming and the polls was either an overt or implied concern about handicapping for the high performing players to level the playing field a bit. One suggestion, that high performing players be required to use stock players in Am tourneys, was rejected in the poll. That left us with another suggestion, which is the basis for this vote, that we use tourney performance and EA ranking to limit Am play. The problem I have with that is that we won't know really who's in the top 5 of the WiiGA tourney until the season ends, based on the wish to have all tourneys posted at the outset of the season, and to allow their play in any order. I suspect that the real consequence is that only EA rank would be the controlling factor. So what you may really be voting on is the restrict players with EA rank in the top 100, 200 or 300 from playing in the Am tourneys. I'm not sure that having the handicap be the required use of designated stock players for high ranking players for AM tournaments wasn't the better choice.
In any event, let's hear from all of you: what do you want?
G.
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Post by broflowski on Aug 24, 2009 13:04:30 GMT -5
I'm not sure how many people will be eligible for the AM tourney if you base it on EA sim rank. Of those that are eligible, how many completed more than 2 rounds in season 2, and how many are projected to complete more than 4 rounds in season 3? I'm concerned that participation in AM will be too low if you prohibit people from participating. I'm all in favor of a handicapping system, but I don't think that prohibition is the answer.
Here are some stats taken from season 2 AM final rankings: Players who completed at least 2 rounds: 14 Players who's lowest score in 4 weeks was <=55: 8 Players who's lowest score in 4 weeks was <=60: 14
If you want to prohibit people from perenially dominating the AM tourney, then prohibit the semifinalists from the next season or something. Is that a great move, I don't know, but I like it better than kicking out a larger number of people.
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Post by gandalf122872 on Aug 24, 2009 13:42:42 GMT -5
I'm not sure how it should be handicapped If you use just EA and its the top 300 then i can play as an am but i finished last season on the league in the top 5 here i don't play alot of onlibne play right now I've been playing mostly with the members of the league when i do play I'm good enough to be pro if i wanna be but i have bad runs where I'm barely and amatuer if i had to figure a handicap I would say use both EA and wiiga ranks
Say that anyone ranked in the top 100, 200, 300(whatever the choose) of EA must play as a pro...also say that anyone who after the playoffs ended up in the top 5 places must play as a pro. I would also say that the league admins should have the right to change someones rankings at anytime...i.e. if they see that i have posted 3 scores and the scores are equal to the people playing pro settings then they should tell me i am no longer eligable to play as an amatuer and must switch to the pro settings.
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giacomo
Co-Founder
The vessel with the pestle...
Posts: 1,295
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Post by giacomo on Aug 24, 2009 14:03:15 GMT -5
Just a note: I'm reading the responses as they come in, but will refrain from commenting myself for a bit while I watch what emerges in the comments.
THIS IS A VITAL QUESTION FOR US! We continue to see much less participation than our membership total suggests we should be having. It has been suggested by a number of members and admins that the core issue is the dominance of some players and the sense among many that they can't compete, so why try? So in addition to the specific question raised in this post, any general thoughts either on handicapping or on increasing participation in general would be hugely welcome.
Thanks!
G.
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jeffro09
Co-Founder
I reckon I should learn how to hit this here driver
Posts: 410
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Post by jeffro09 on Aug 24, 2009 14:28:23 GMT -5
I know I may be oversimplifying......and it may become anadministrative nightmare for the admins...if so I will offer my help in any way needed.
But the best way to find out what limited the participation is if it became a membership requirement for anyone who has not participated in the tourneys provide their reasons. Then as a part II to their response their recommendation as to what would have to happen to encourage their participation.
If all the people that did participate try to make assumptions on those folks behalf attempt to guess what the issue is then it may not change the results.
Just a thought.
Jeffro
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Post by broflowski on Aug 24, 2009 17:19:16 GMT -5
I understand that some people may feel overwhelmed by the thought of competing against some of the wiiga'rs. I know I am sometimes (read: crapping myself while thinking about having to play jeffro in the finals ). I wonder if we'd get more involvement by having tiers based on scores. Most sports leagues have A/B/C tiers to offer all levels of competition. Maybe we could try tiers with separate leaderboards and separate playoffs? I really prefer the AM putting settings but said that I'd be willing to play exclusively PRO to get more people involved. If asking for a tiered leaderboard to be created prompts the need for more admins, I'd be more than willing to help. What do the new members think?
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Post by stevesuk on Aug 25, 2009 4:12:46 GMT -5
Sorry been away for a while so not had any input into the new season yet.
I'm a new member and am just itching to get involved in the new season. I don't mind what my settings are as have used all of them now so just need someone to tell me whether i'm playing as a Pro or Am and what settings to use.
Not sure I like the idea of having a tiering system .... will that mean the Am guys will never get to play the Pro guys ?. Not sure about how other new members feel but I would love to play you 'Pro' people just to get experience, perhaps pick up a few tips and improve my game.
Don't mind if I loose every game and am bottom of the Leaderboard, it would be nice just to play you guys.
Saying that, i'll go with whatever is decided.
Bring on the new season !!!
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Post by broflowski on Aug 25, 2009 8:37:06 GMT -5
Steve, I like the attitude. I'm looking forward to seeing you out on the course.
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Post by stevesuk on Aug 27, 2009 4:35:04 GMT -5
Have voted and here's my twopeneth worth (sorry ... english phrase !!!)
Top 100 EA ranked and Top 5 WiiGA leaderboard to be Pro.
Pro's not allowed to play in an Amatuer event but Amatuers allowed to compete against Pro's if they so wish (as in real life)
Any chance of a European WiiGA leaderboard ? ;-)
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Post by neil29679 on Aug 27, 2009 4:59:42 GMT -5
ive voted for other. as i mentioned in another post. i think players should declare their own status. we are here to enjoy playing so you should play the game how you like. status should NOT be FORCED. i strongly encourage this option. its about as many players possible having as much fun as possible. im pretty sure the very top players will refrain from declaring themselves as am and dominating that board.
at the time of posting the option for other is being heavily out voted. if u share my opinion PLEASE comment or even change your vote if it is possible. or if the admins think its a goer but its still being outvoted feel free to overule the vote for the good of the league.
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Post by tiger666 on Aug 27, 2009 15:41:47 GMT -5
My two cents ~ I have to agree with neilz. When I play ranked games, I usually set up a nine hole match at St. Andrews. I usually shoot between 27 and 30 .... hardly in the class with Jeffro, Jokker and the other top Wiiga players.
BUT ~ because I'm in the top EA 100 I have to play pro. I don't mind 'cause I enjoy watching Jeffro and the rest throw darts at every green. On the other hand, always losing gets a little old as well.
The only reason I made the top five in the current season is because only six people played all four rounds.
AN IDEA ~ members who have never won a WiiGA event play in one amateur tourney. The "good" players" are in the pro. If the amateur players want to try the pro as well, more power to them. I'll be one of them.
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